Register    Login    Forum    Search    FAQ

Board index » GENERAL CHAT » The news stand




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 36 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

Share On:

Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Madeleine McCann
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 8:32 am 
Offline
Manager
Manager
User avatar

Joined: Mon Mar 08, 2004 7:19 am
Posts: 22597
Location: Cannock.
Rozza wrote:
The McCanns were, and are still, a solid and rigid family unit. Their relationship has had no hiccups or revelations since the events.
Those simple things alone speak volumes for their commitments to each other in their fight to understand what happened.
Having investigated, to some degree or another, the best part of 40 odd murders in my time in the job, the McCanns would have capitulated to the event by now.

Their enduring pain circumvents the scrutiny of pseudo sleuths over the years in my book, leave em be, because whatever punishment that the state could purvey upon them pales into insignificance when considering the abject misery that they have already absorbed in their lives.


Interesting post that Roz, much food for thought.

_________________
Wolves fans, this is your day. Its going to be emotional.

If team culture is weak losing divides the team. If team culture is strong, losing creates the hunger to win again. Either way culture rules.


Top 
 Profile  
 
Share on Facebook Facebook Share on Twitter Twitter
 Post subject: Re: Madeleine McCann
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 9:31 am 
Offline
Manager
Manager
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 1:26 am
Posts: 23349
Location: South East Bulgaria
knocker knowles wrote:
Rozza wrote:
The McCanns were, and are still, a solid and rigid family unit. Their relationship has had no hiccups or revelations since the events.
Those simple things alone speak volumes for their commitments to each other in their fight to understand what happened.
Having investigated, to some degree or another, the best part of 40 odd murders in my time in the job, the McCanns would have capitulated to the event by now.

Their enduring pain circumvents the scrutiny of pseudo sleuths over the years in my book, leave em be, because whatever punishment that the state could purvey upon them pales into insignificance when considering the abject misery that they have already absorbed in their lives.


Interesting post that Roz, much food for thought.


Fair points Roz, but I don't really care about them as individuals - there were both creche and babysitting services available in that Warner complex. The latter service was/is a paid for service if the sitter has to go an apartment, but for a couple of Doctors then, I guess it is peanuts so why didn't they use the services available instead of leaving a patio door unlocked. I wouldn't leave my holiday home door unlocked whilst out wining and dining even if it was on next door's patio. I recall MOLI (remember him) reciting his experience in Spain where some toerag entered their holiday home, opened their safe (with code) and stole all of their money and documents. I'm fairly sure these type of stories are numerous so why do two middle class Doctors go out with confidence that it was okay to leave two twin toddlers and young child EVEN after they had ''allegedly'' themselves reported that the night before, Madeleine had been heard crying by an upstairs resident and apparently, for a long time.

Yes, I fully understand that hindsight is a great thing and that we all make fook-ups and get away with them by good luck or good fortune. Now, with all of your detective experience, tell me, based on the open source material available (you might well have Police insider grapevine views that you cannot share), would you say that upon the evidence supplied that there was a break-in or break-out via that shuttered window or that it was staged? That, as I understand it, is the view of the Portuguese Investigator(s)?

I think that IF I go back through the McCann threads on here then, initially, I was fully supportive and defensive of their actions on that night, but the worm has turned perhaps due to many ''pseudo sleuths'' and multiple others' contributions with damning details. I might well have forgotten about the case altogether and let sleeping dogs lie albeit, I am again of the opinion that the book written by Mrs. McCann did little to keep the search for her daughter alive, but more to produce money and provide more muddled and changed versions of events for us sleuths to feed off. :wink:

BTW, when I do see a blondish looking kid here with our Gypsy population (which was a one-time event) I did look very closely and wondered IF she had been abducted from her parents at some stage. Albeit, this kid I did see, didn't blink an eye of understanding when I spoke in English and looked happy enough as a part of a small band of beggars in a Bulgarian small town supermarket car park. I recall being in a conundrum as IF I showed too much attention towards this young girl, I might get accused or suspected of being a Nonce as that is the kind of world we live in today - guilty before proving yourself innocent, which sums up my feeling towards the McCanns who in my book, haven't proved themselves innocent at all.

Keep em Peeled. :wink:

_________________
Better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.

Mark Twain


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl3PabIYDTl_WqVc4Aitv_g

https://twitter.com/wolf_moscow


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Madeleine McCann
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 10:03 am 
Offline
Forum Moderator
Forum Moderator

Joined: Mon Feb 23, 2004 11:55 pm
Posts: 18042
Mos.
If you think of how you yourself cover a secret, or an event, or an incident that you were caught out on that causes you embarrassment or hurt, say you had a marital affair, or were caught in public toilets with another bloke or you self harmed or summat, you would perhaps everyday, ponder on that event or time and be riddled by guilt and or remorse.
If you shared that burden alone, then over time it would become easier to bear but painful nonetheless, if someone else knew of your faux pas then your hurt/guilt/embarrassment would be doubled.

Now if you had to shoulder the burden of the killing of your child with your partner just how much torture could you bear by covering that up knowing what you did?
The pain of knowing that your actions or indeed inaction's caused that death is bad enough and would be a constant and massive strain upon your relationship with your partner and your family. The fact that they have stayed together, and stayed strong together speaks volumes about them and their 'Involvement' in this event.

My own personal view is two fold and both scenarios involve Madeline alighting from her bed to find her parents and walking freely out of her door to do so. The first involves the abduction by chance by a stranger who's arms she innocently walked into, who then took her away, did what he needed to do and then disposed of her in one of a thousand ways.
The second is the pissed up driver who was unable to avoid running her over as she ran confused into the road. Realising his/her predicament, he/she has thrown her into their car and driven her off and then disposed of her.
The perpetrator of these supposed events must live with the same thoughts and guilt that the McCanns do, but the McCanns is an enduring one that is riddled with the "What If". The difference is that only one person knows of it because the other one is dead.

The competency of the Portuguese Police in investigating such matters must also be factored in as to whether it was good enough or they had the necessary experience. From my knowledge of the tale so far the McCanns were regarded as a necessary impediment to the investigation by the investigators which is totally at odds with the Family Liaison approach that the British Police use.

Mind you, the murders of Jessica and Holly a few years back was quite similar. The force who investigated their deaths were totally ill equipped to do so and lacked the necessary skills and procedures to investigate them properly until the point the investigation was removed from them and taken on by bigger, more experienced forces.
I attended a lecture by the original SIO (Senior Investigating Officer) of the Holly and Jessica murders, at the time I had read the book by the father of Holly Wells too. The SIO roundly described the father as a pain in the arse, to a point where he considered sanctions against him for obstructing the investigation. The fact the father was doing what any father would have done, me included, and was pissed off due to the lack of direction the investigation was going in was lost on the SIO the dozy twat.

In most cases of child abduction the subject is deceased quite soon afterwards, the problem then exists of disposal. British Police have in depth studies of deposition points and geographic data where bodies were disposed of in the past to help them, I doubt the Portuguese Police had any such expertise or indeed the will to extend their enquiries past the dislike of two errant English parents, who knows.

_________________
There is no substitute for hard work.


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Madeleine McCann
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 10:34 am 
Offline
Manager
Manager

Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:38 am
Posts: 15290
Location: Moved
Rozza wrote:
The McCanns were, and are still, a solid and rigid family unit. Their relationship has had no hiccups or revelations since the events.
Those simple things alone speak volumes for their commitments to each other in their fight to understand what happened.
Having investigated, to some degree or another, the best part of 40 odd murders in my time in the job, the McCanns would have capitulated to the event by now.

Their enduring pain circumvents the scrutiny of pseudo sleuths over the years in my book, leave em be, because whatever punishment that the state could purvey upon them pales into insignificance when considering the abject misery that they have already absorbed in their lives.



Yep. Any normal marriage would have buckled under the pressure of keeping such a dark secret.

Any normal marriage. Simple fact is the poor girl has not been found. No one except the abductors the parents or the girl herself if it was an accident, knows or knew what happened.

Still believe in Shit happens and the McCanns if innocent, have been and continue to go through hell. Are they innocent ? If Rozza's hard earned reasoning is true they are.....but somebody knows. Piss poor work from the pork and cheese has not helped, I'm sure the genuine opinions of the UK lads sent over will come out in time. Not the press conference views, but what they actually thought but couldn't perhaps comment.

_________________
Dyslexics are teople poo


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Madeleine McCann
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 10:46 am 
Offline
Manager
Manager
User avatar

Joined: Thu Feb 19, 2004 1:26 am
Posts: 23349
Location: South East Bulgaria
Yes, I take all of that onboard, but TWO sharing a burden and knowing that if one breaks then, they're both fooked is easier than one alone, I should think?

Your scenarios of events are plausible albeit, I, and I guess many others cannot discount the evidence supplied of DNA, blood and cadaver indicators. If those pieces of the jigsaw could be fully accounted for and removed from the scene then, I too would go along with a death by misfortune via roadkill or abduction.

I guess we Brits consider any foreign Plod to be bumbling Inspector Clouseau types, but the initial Investigator was basing his investigation on numerical statistical fact that in most child abduction claims, the Parents have mostly done the child in and therefore, that he channelled his investigation in trying to prove that first (is what I suspect), whilst paying lesser investigation efforts into a pure abduction which in either scenario, is what any Parent would want.

Now, in the wandering out into the street and being involved in a hit and run scenario, surely there would be blood traces in the street - I couldn't say for sure. Wandering out of the unlocked but not necessarily open patio door (if she was strong enough to slide it and ease herself out and then falling and splitting her head open would be my first choice of possible/probable scenarios and either one of the Parents, returning for their 15-30 minute checks, discovering her body, going into a panic, hiding her behind the sofa under the window for a while...... who knows, the mind runs wild with possible scenarios.

If there is any credence to my last scenario then, what would the Parents have been guilty of IF they had held their hands-up? Negligence, loss of face, and perhaps some wrist slap for leaving underaged minors alone.

Too much for a Sunday morning and now I am feeling guilty about leaving the Wife's arse sticking up out of the ground, but I needed somewhere to park my Pushbike. Can't beat the old jokes. :wink:

_________________
Better to keep your mouth shut and appear stupid than to open it and remove all doubt.

Mark Twain


https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCl3PabIYDTl_WqVc4Aitv_g

https://twitter.com/wolf_moscow


Top 
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Madeleine McCann
 Post Posted: Sun Oct 08, 2017 11:18 am 
Offline
Manager
Manager

Joined: Mon Oct 08, 2007 1:38 am
Posts: 15290
Location: Moved
Not sure about the West Mids, but the rest of the world's forces fuck up big time more often than they would like to admit to.

Back in the mists of time I was sent to be an Instructor at the jolly Police Training school ( If you can't do teach !!! )

One of the core subjects for the new Inspectorate officers ( 9 months basic training so there were plenty of them ) was your bog-standard Death Report. That's the thing sent off to the Coroner before the inquest. The examples at the school were somewhat tired, so I packed myself off to the nearest big nick and picked up a pile of recent ones. Gave them out to the poor bleeders in my tender care, minus the conclusions and recommendations. Told them to take them back to the barracks overnight and prepare presentations on their conclusion's the following day.

One of the lads in my squad was a force-entry detective sergeant. How he passed the selection I will never know as he was a great bloke who took no shit ( force entrants usually a tad more compliant).

He came to my office before the start of the day and asked for a quick word. I sat him down and he explained the file he had been given was not a job for the Coroner, as it was a murder. Fuck me thought I. We sat down and went through his reasoning. Couldn't fault it, so slipped out to the nick and went to see a pal or two. They of course were horrified and called me and me lad all sorts of names, but after sitting down and actually looking at the file, they had to agree....monumental fuck-up time.

Shit happens.

_________________
Dyslexics are teople poo


Top 
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
 
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 36 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

Board index » GENERAL CHAT » The news stand


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 3 guests

 
 

 
You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  

The Wolf will always be free to its members, but if you feel you would like to contribute towards the running costs, than please feel free to donate.

 

 

Disclaimer : This forum is for the general discussion/topic of Wolverhampton Wanderers. What is said within the forum is personal opinions, and The Wolf will not be held responsible. Your ip is logged for security reasons. The forum is viewable by the public and any topics you disclose/discuss can be viewed by the public. Some topics on this forum may only be suitable for those aged 18+.

cron