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 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 6:42 pm 
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Having seen off Mr Cameron and Mrs May, and the country showing no enthusiasm for Mr Corbyn, the European issue is set to destroy yet more reputations before the whole saga is complete.

Yes - there will be candidates, but EVERYONE was hoping May could sort it and THEN they would stab her in the back and become prime minister (Labour or Tory).

Jeremy shouts for an election but doesn't want one - HE would have to sort the mess and reveal the HUGE split in his own party.

Tories don't want one either, but neither do they want the responsibility of squaring this circle.

It is an impossible task. Who can do it? Meanwhile, in France and Italy and.... the natives are restless.... I fear the rise of the far right in almost all countries.

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 Post Posted: Fri May 24, 2019 10:47 pm 
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It's an important distinction to make between leading the country and being PM.

There are umpteen powercrazed egomaniacs who would love to be PM, it's a bit embarrassing going back to your old public school reunion if you haven't been PM at least once after all.

Unfortunately for the general population of the UK there are absolutely no candidates in the present House of Commons with the ability to lead the country.

Very sad times for old Blighty and exactly the wrong time to be standing on your own.

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 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 8:45 am 
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Should there be a national debate about a continuation of policies which have been in place for 40 years or a change to Socialism?

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 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 10:34 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
Should there be a national debate about a continuation of policies which have been in place for 40 years or a change to Socialism?


And that included 13 years of "Socialist" government of course. Perhaps the discussion should be about what other alternatives are possible.

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 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 10:58 am 
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Left back wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
Should there be a national debate about a continuation of policies which have been in place for 40 years or a change to Socialism?


And that included 13 years of "Socialist" government of course. Perhaps the discussion should be about what other alternatives are possible.


Mmmm. 13 from forty equals........

Would seem the electorate has already spoken many times about socialism.

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 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 1:23 pm 
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suiging wrote:
Left back wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
Should there be a national debate about a continuation of policies which have been in place for 40 years or a change to Socialism?


And that included 13 years of "Socialist" government of course. Perhaps the discussion should be about what other alternatives are possible.


Mmmm. 13 from forty equals........

Would seem the electorate has already spoken many times about socialism.


We had socialist policy just after the second world war, then maybe under Wilson in the sixties.

The electorate actually liked the last Labour manifesto it was well supported from a very low starting base.. It enabled Labour to create the current situation with no overall majority.

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 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 1:30 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:

We had socialist policy just after the second world war, then maybe under Wilson in the sixties.

The electorate actually liked the last Labour manifesto it was well supported from a very low starting base.. It enabled Labour to create the current situation with no overall majority.


But it didn't convince enough people to give them a majority did it? Much of what they did gain was based on convincing the young voters they would get everything they wanted despite it being economically unrealistic.

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 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 1:38 pm 
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Love the new twitter profile of Ed Miliband.

Chaos with Ed Miliband.

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 Post Posted: Sat May 25, 2019 3:07 pm 
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SilverstoneWolf wrote:

It is an impossible task. Who can do it? Meanwhile, in France and Italy and.... the natives are restless.... I fear the rise of the far right in almost all countries.


This current surge aided and abetted by the liberalist policies of the EU and its governments.
Dictating who isn't , and- more relevantly - is allowed,regardless of the opinion of its citizens.

It just helps to foster a feeling of being taken advantage of, and of resentment ,whether you agree with it or not this open doors policy hasn't helped.
People don't understand or even agree that countries should be dictated to in this way.

Was it Sweden (I think) that encouraged an open doors policy that eventually resulted in a resurgence of the far right , and with an anti-imigration backlash from even those of a more central disspostion.

It's a fine dividing line between a feeling of humanitarianism , and of exploitation.
Liberals don't understand it and call everyone even slightly to the right of their line facists


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 Post Posted: Sun May 26, 2019 9:02 am 
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davejonesears wrote:
SilverstoneWolf wrote:

It is an impossible task. Who can do it? Meanwhile, in France and Italy and.... the natives are restless.... I fear the rise of the far right in almost all countries.


This current surge aided and abetted by the liberalist policies of the EU and its governments.
Dictating who isn't , and- more relevantly - is allowed,regardless of the opinion of its citizens.

It just helps to foster a feeling of being taken advantage of, and of resentment ,whether you agree with it or not this open doors policy hasn't helped.
People don't understand or even agree that countries should be dictated to in this way.

Was it Sweden (I think) that encouraged an open doors policy that eventually resulted in a resurgence of the far right , and with an anti-imigration backlash from even those of a more central disspostion.


It's a fine dividing line between a feeling of humanitarianism , and of exploitation.
Liberals don't understand it and call everyone even slightly to the right of their line facists



Is the resentment because those who were fortunate by way of a postcode lottery to be born into a better situation than others finding the less fortunate being offered the same deal?

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 Post Posted: Sun May 26, 2019 11:12 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
davejonesears wrote:
SilverstoneWolf wrote:

It is an impossible task. Who can do it? Meanwhile, in France and Italy and.... the natives are restless.... I fear the rise of the far right in almost all countries.


This current surge aided and abetted by the liberalist policies of the EU and its governments.
Dictating who isn't , and- more relevantly - is allowed,regardless of the opinion of its citizens.

It just helps to foster a feeling of being taken advantage of, and of resentment ,whether you agree with it or not this open doors policy hasn't helped.
People don't understand or even agree that countries should be dictated to in this way.

Was it Sweden (I think) that encouraged an open doors policy that eventually resulted in a resurgence of the far right , and with an anti-imigration backlash from even those of a more central disspostion.


It's a fine dividing line between a feeling of humanitarianism , and of exploitation.
Liberals don't understand it and call everyone even slightly to the right of their line facists



Is the resentment because those who were fortunate by way of a postcode lottery to be born into a better situation than others finding the less fortunate being offered the same deal?


Well yes it may be I suppose , if one feels financially secure the 'impact' of an open doors policy may be felt less, and therefore the reaction could be less.

However that's not really the point is it, the point is that the unfeted immigration policies of certain countries within the EU (*cough Germany) has resulted in the resurgence of far right tendencies in countries that even previously may have been considered somewhat Liberal.

It ironic that Merkel's liberal stance , apparently caused the impact of the West/East Germany split, has resulted in a backlash in other countries .
An increase in the feelings of things being forced onto countries by bigger countries- if that makes sense.


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 Post Posted: Sun May 26, 2019 2:19 pm 
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Its important for people to realise that being part of a coalition that bombs different regions you destabilise folk who then look for another part of the planet to live and feel safe.

Imagine if the West had spent that money on infrastructure rather than armed misery,

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 Post Posted: Sun May 26, 2019 4:28 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
Its important for people to realise that being part of a coalition that bombs different regions you destabilise folk who then look for another part of the planet to live and feel safe.

Imagine if the West had spent that money on infrastructure rather than armed misery,


You mean like Russia is doing in Syria?

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 Post Posted: Sun May 26, 2019 7:35 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
davejonesears wrote:
SilverstoneWolf wrote:

It is an impossible task. Who can do it? Meanwhile, in France and Italy and.... the natives are restless.... I fear the rise of the far right in almost all countries.


This current surge aided and abetted by the liberalist policies of the EU and its governments.
Dictating who isn't , and- more relevantly - is allowed,regardless of the opinion of its citizens.

It just helps to foster a feeling of being taken advantage of, and of resentment ,whether you agree with it or not this open doors policy hasn't helped.
People don't understand or even agree that countries should be dictated to in this way.

Was it Sweden (I think) that encouraged an open doors policy that eventually resulted in a resurgence of the far right , and with an anti-imigration backlash from even those of a more central disspostion.


It's a fine dividing line between a feeling of humanitarianism , and of exploitation.
Liberals don't understand it and call everyone even slightly to the right of their line facists



Is the resentment because those who were fortunate by way of a postcode lottery to be born into a better situation than others finding the less fortunate being offered the same deal?


Presumably KK you are supporting Michael Gove for Tory leader, as the one who was born into disadvantage and still is unaware of who his parents might be. Being bright and determined, he won scholarships to prestigious institutions that his adoptive parents were unable to afford, but happy to encourage him too strive for academic excellence. Gotta admire the bloke even if you don;t like him or agree with his politics.

(But for what it is worth, if you rely on the press and trade union leaflets for information, you will get a completely distorted view of what the bloke actually believes in and stands for. Passionate anti-selection in schools; passionately driven to improve the lot of the disadvantaged in education. When Labour accused him of 'stealing their clothes', he simply pointed out what a hopeless mess they had made of it - failing to do anything about social mobility during all their years in government. He is an interesting bloke, even if you detest him! Watch out in the coming days, and LISTEN to his arguments. I expect him to set out a much more bold vision for the country than just a 'let's get through the Brexit mess' debate. We will see!!

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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 7:40 am 
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At the moment Gove comes about 5th on my wish list.

I look forward to listening to his vision on all aspects of society.

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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 8:17 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
At the moment Gove comes about 5th on my wish list.

I look forward to listening to his vision on all aspects of society.



Who do you think will take over what's left of the Labour Party ?

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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 8:31 am 
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Can you imagine the shift in inner city voting if a brown face led the Tories?? The Royals have become all inclusive perhaps its now for politics in general and the Tories in particular to follow suit.

VOTE FOR SAJID

25/1 :wink:

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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 10:26 am 
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Rozza wrote:
Can you imagine the shift in inner city voting if a brown face led the Tories?? The Royals have become all inclusive perhaps its now for politics in general and the Tories in particular to follow suit.

VOTE FOR SAJID

25/1 :wink:


I don't think he will get it tbh...not sure what hes done to deserve it... although what has any of them done.


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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 1:08 pm 
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suiging wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
At the moment Gove comes about 5th on my wish list.

I look forward to listening to his vision on all aspects of society.



Who do you think will take over what's left of the Labour Party ?


Another shake-up is surely overdue, too, and that is around the shadow cabinet table. Many of them are barely visible to the public; Corbyn surely needs more big hitters who can refocus the national debate on Labour’s currently marginalised priorities. The first suggestion is Ed Miliband. These column inches used to be filled with my despair over the timidity of that Labour era, but could New Labour ever have seamlessly transitioned to Corbynism? Miliband was the bridge between the two, as he acknowledges himself: a man who had the right diagnosis of Britain’s broken social order, but feared offering a genuinely courageous break with it, a man torn between the radicalism of his father and his time as a New Labour apparatchik. “He’s more leftwing privately than you think,” I was often told by those who knew him at the time, but he became too much of a prisoner of his woefully unambitious shadow chancellor, Ed Balls.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... are_btn_tw

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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 1:11 pm 
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Rozza wrote:
Can you imagine the shift in inner city voting if a brown face led the Tories?? The Royals have become all inclusive perhaps its now for politics in general and the Tories in particular to follow suit.

VOTE FOR SAJID

25/1 :wink:


The Royals would not have approved their first son.

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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 1:59 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
suiging wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
At the moment Gove comes about 5th on my wish list.

I look forward to listening to his vision on all aspects of society.



Who do you think will take over what's left of the Labour Party ?


Another shake-up is surely overdue, too, and that is around the shadow cabinet table. Many of them are barely visible to the public; Corbyn surely needs more big hitters who can refocus the national debate on Labour’s currently marginalised priorities. The first suggestion is Ed Miliband. These column inches used to be filled with my despair over the timidity of that Labour era, but could New Labour ever have seamlessly transitioned to Corbynism? Miliband was the bridge between the two, as he acknowledges himself: a man who had the right diagnosis of Britain’s broken social order, but feared offering a genuinely courageous break with it, a man torn between the radicalism of his father and his time as a New Labour apparatchik. “He’s more leftwing privately than you think,” I was often told by those who knew him at the time, but he became too much of a prisoner of his woefully unambitious shadow chancellor, Ed Balls.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfr ... are_btn_tw


Oh yes pleaseeeeeeee. More of Ed, comedy gold.

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 Post Posted: Thu May 30, 2019 6:20 pm 
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I don't much care WHO leads the Labour or Tory parties.

What I DO care about is the vision for the future of this country that they give me, AND THEN ACT ON to make it become reality.

There are FAR too many who are blinded by short-termism and focus groups and opinion polls.

WHY ON EARTH should Labour or the Tories constantly shift policy on say the second referendum?? Tell us what you BELIEVE and why you believe it. Stop treating it as a popularity contest - a sort of 'viewer phone-in your result' contest.

We want a BELIEF in SOMETHING!

Big state - state action - state interference - high taxes to provide state-funded industry, projects, services, support for anyone who wants to be supported (need it or not)

Or Small state - with individual freedoms to decide - lower taxes because no state industries to leak money, no vanity projects (so no Boris please!!!), fewer services, support only for those in need, not those who demand....

Oh well.... I'll hold my breath.... then exhale....

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 Post Posted: Fri May 31, 2019 9:04 am 
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Another Tory that impresses from the back benches, David Cartlidge.

Prepared to call the big boys out for their lies and deceptions.

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 Post Posted: Fri May 31, 2019 10:37 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
Another Tory that impresses from the back benches, David Cartlidge.

Prepared to call the big boys out for their lies and deceptions.



Who now another back bencher ?
yeah right thats what we need to head the country at this time, still his inexperience may help against your back bencher....
bit like Rory Stewart impressed you ...I think his private life is startig to appear suspect ...I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him, and neither I hope will his fellow MP's, the Membership most def. won't , thank god.


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 Post Posted: Fri May 31, 2019 11:06 am 
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davejonesears wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
Another Tory that impresses from the back benches, David Cartlidge.

Prepared to call the big boys out for their lies and deceptions.



Who now another back bencher ?
yeah right thats what we need to head the country at this time, still his inexperience may help against your back bencher....
bit like Rory Stewart impressed you ...I think his private life is startig to appear suspect ...I wouldn't trust him as far as I could throw him, and neither I hope will his fellow MP's, the Membership most def. won't , thank god.


I could write endlessly about Tories I don't like, the list is endless.

What I'm trying to do is find a few I do like. Think positive in grave times

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 Post Posted: Mon Jul 22, 2019 10:14 pm 
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Oh dear that other lot vote in another bear faced liar in Jo Swinson. Sad times.

Ed Davey would have been far better. Shame.

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 Post Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 12:53 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
Oh dear that other lot vote in another bear faced liar in Jo Swinson. Sad times.

Ed Davey would have been far better. Shame.


There's no need to be rude about the way she looks.

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 Post Posted: Tue Jul 23, 2019 2:13 pm 
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Left back wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
Oh dear that other lot vote in another bear faced liar in Jo Swinson. Sad times.

Ed Davey would have been far better. Shame.


There's no need to be rude about the way she looks.


He may need to paws before he recognises his grammatical boo boo!

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 Post Posted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 1:12 pm 
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So now we have Johnson.

Give us strength.

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 Post Posted: Wed Jul 24, 2019 2:39 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
So now we have Johnson.

Give us strength.


So given the current leaders of the respective parties and their parties stance - or perceived stance at least - on Brexit ,who do you think would win a GE tomorrow ?


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