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 Post Posted: Sat Sep 30, 2017 12:26 pm 
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The Kings fund is usually a far more reliable source for factual information regards the NHS.

Just off the top off your head what percentage increase does the NHS require to maintain its standards or to bring those standards back to reasonable levels.

We look about 20 billion short to me.

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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 1:20 pm 
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Scrap foreign aid ... you'll get that £20b in under two years.


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 Post Posted: Sun Oct 01, 2017 4:40 pm 
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DazDC5 wrote:
Scrap foreign aid ... you'll get that £20b in under two years.


Only treat those who can actually prove who they actually are, false identity coupled with tourism medication/treatment is massive and is an issue I doubt any NHS managers want to face up to.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 8:13 am 
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Rozza wrote:
DazDC5 wrote:
Scrap foreign aid ... you'll get that £20b in under two years.


Only treat those who can actually prove who they actually are, false identity coupled with tourism medication/treatment is massive and is an issue I doubt any NHS managers want to face up to.


Massive, hmm, didn't know that, thought it was about 1% of the NHS budget.

I think a bigger more growing problem is the costs of hiring outside contractors and nurses from the private sector.
Filling the gaps caused by the lack of nurse training under this government.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 8:40 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
Rozza wrote:
DazDC5 wrote:
Scrap foreign aid ... you'll get that £20b in under two years.


Only treat those who can actually prove who they actually are, false identity coupled with tourism medication/treatment is massive and is an issue I doubt any NHS managers want to face up to.


Massive, hmm, didn't know that, thought it was about 1% of the NHS budget.

I think a bigger more growing problem is the costs of hiring outside contractors and nurses from the private sector.
Filling the gaps caused by the lack of nurse training under this government.


1% of the £416,000,000,000,000 NHS budget can buy a lot of sandals and Mercedes kk.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:02 am 
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]Scrap foreign aid ... you'll get that £20b in under two years.[/quote]

Only treat those who can actually prove who they actually are, false identity coupled with tourism medication/treatment is massive and is an issue I doubt any NHS managers want to face up to.[/quote]

Massive, hmm, didn't know that, thought it was about 1% of the NHS budget.

I think a bigger more growing problem is the costs of hiring outside contractors and nurses from the private sector.
Filling the gaps caused by the lack of nurse training under this government.[/quote]

1% of the £416,000,000,000,000 NHS budget can buy a lot of sandals and Mercedes kk.[/quote]

I dont dismiss that cost to the NHS but find its used as a convenient distraction away from more pressing problems like the Private sector costs.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 11:15 am 
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Only if you want it to.

I wonder how many pregnant women fly into the UK from around the world each year and fly out a little lighter a few weeks later?

But of course the NHS was built on the premise of "Free to all" wor it, but the world was a far bigger place when Mr Bevan was on it.

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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:44 am 
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Rozza wrote:
Only if you want it to.

I wonder how many pregnant women fly into the UK from around the world each year and fly out a little lighter a few weeks later?

But of course the NHS was built on the premise of "Free to all" wor it, but the world was a far bigger place when Mr Bevan was on it.


The point is if we focus on this lessor problem we miss the bigger problems.
which are gross underfunding, poor recruitment and training and the increased sell off to the private sector.

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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 12:56 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
Rozza wrote:
Only if you want it to.

I wonder how many pregnant women fly into the UK from around the world each year and fly out a little lighter a few weeks later?

But of course the NHS was built on the premise of "Free to all" wor it, but the world was a far bigger place when Mr Bevan was on it.


The point is if we focus on this lessor problem we miss the bigger problems.
which are gross underfunding, poor recruitment and training and the increased sell off to the private sector.


or the abuse of the system by all and sundry


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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 7:11 am 
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davejonesears wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
Rozza wrote:
Only if you want it to.

I wonder how many pregnant women fly into the UK from around the world each year and fly out a little lighter a few weeks later?

But of course the NHS was built on the premise of "Free to all" wor it, but the world was a far bigger place when Mr Bevan was on it.


The point is if we focus on this lessor problem we miss the bigger problems.
which are gross underfunding, poor recruitment and training and the increased sell off to the private sector.


or the abuse of the system by all and sundry


Tories try to deflect blame from themselves by trying to tar everyone with the same brush.

Just use a computer to check Hospital waiting lists and targets hit under Labour compared to what we have now.

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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:02 am 
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You don't think Blair throwing open the doors to this country ( which he is still trying to jam open) hasn't contributed to current NHS waiting lists ?

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 Post Posted: Sat Oct 07, 2017 8:10 am 
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suiging wrote:
You don't think Blair throwing open the doors to this country ( which he is still trying to jam open) hasn't contributed to current NHS waiting lists ?



I think each and every government has allowed to many people to arrive from the former Commonwealth countries.

People who have no wish to assimilate to the British culture but follow religious nuts which drives divisions further apart.

Now with the Tories looking to open up new markets post brexit they will fear closing the door on Commonwealth immigration for fear of losing economically.

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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:40 am 
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Tories have a target of 100,000 per year immigrants into the country, a target they keep failing to achieve.

Meanwhile the Tory Mayor of the West Midlands wants 150,000 a year.

Is he right, does he represent your views?

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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:44 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
Tories have a target of 100,000 per year immigrants into the country, a target they keep failing to achieve.

Meanwhile the Tory Mayor of the West Midlands wants 150,000 a year.

Is he right, does he represent your views?



How many would Abbott let in ? You don't know ? No one does as she has no idea about anything other than what she sees on her run to her children's private school

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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 8:51 am 
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suiging wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
Tories have a target of 100,000 per year immigrants into the country, a target they keep failing to achieve.

Meanwhile the Tory Mayor of the West Midlands wants 150,000 a year.

Is he right, does he represent your views?



How many would Abbott let in ? You don't know ? No one does as she has no idea about anything other than what she sees on her run to her children's private school


So again you avoid the question.

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 Post Posted: Mon Oct 09, 2017 11:12 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
suiging wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
Tories have a target of 100,000 per year immigrants into the country, a target they keep failing to achieve.

Meanwhile the Tory Mayor of the West Midlands wants 150,000 a year.

Is he right, does he represent your views?



How many would Abbott let in ? You don't know ? No one does as she has no idea about anything other than what she sees on her run to her children's private school


So again you avoid the question.


My views are simple. This country setting "quotas" is fatuous. We have borders and we have our own citizens. Folk from other countries should be allowed in if they add value to our country regardless of race colour or creed. If you/they are needed, in you/they come. If you are going to go straight onto this countries benefit merry-go-round and have nothing to contribute, sorry try Germany. By value, I don't mean enriching this country's ethnic diversity for the sake of doing so, we are refreshingly diverse enough. I simply mean contributing to the economy for the benefit of all. Thus if you are French and wish to retire on the South Coast, as long as you can support yourself and add to the local economy, welcome. If you are a medical professional from India, and have relevant qualifications, welcome. To have quotas to be filled with people who don't meet the above simple criteria, is not beneficial to this land or it's people.

So I don't agree with any quota.

Now for the record, what's your view Knocker ?

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 8:17 am 
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I would accept the terms of free movement from the EU with certain stipulations regards having jobs within a certain time or forced repatriation.

And I would completely close the door on all non EU immigrants apart from the Professionals required due to a national shortfall.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 9:19 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
I would accept the terms of free movement from the EU with certain stipulations regards having jobs within a certain time or forced repatriation.

And I would completely close the door on all non EU immigrants apart from the Professionals required due to a national shortfall.



Accepting the terms of free movement but adding a caveat of forced repatriation? Little confused as your idea is surely not accepting the terms of free movement ...... ?

I know Jezza is the master of saying one thing, but totally meaning another..... I didn't think you'd go down that path mate.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:50 am 
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suiging wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
I would accept the terms of free movement from the EU with certain stipulations regards having jobs within a certain time or forced repatriation.

And I would completely close the door on all non EU immigrants apart from the Professionals required due to a national shortfall.



Accepting the terms of free movement but adding a caveat of forced repatriation? Little confused as your idea is surely not accepting the terms of free movement ...... ?

I know Jezza is the master of saying one thing, but totally meaning another..... I didn't think you'd go down that path mate.



The UK government has already reached an agreement on out-of-work benefits. Newly arrived EU migrants are banned from claiming jobseeker's allowance for three months. If they have not found a job within six months they will be required to leave. EU migrant workers in the UK who lose their job, through no fault of their own, are entitled to the same benefits as UK citizens, including jobseekers allowance and housing benefit, for six months.


http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-e ... m-35622105

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 12:39 pm 
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Forced repatriation equates to torture nowadays, next.....

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 4:34 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
And I would completely close the door on all non EU immigrants apart from the Professionals required due to a national shortfall.


How is that going to play when you are needing to do a trade deal with them?

More freedom of movement for their citizens to enter the UK will be pushed for by every country the UK tries to negotiate with. India, for one, is furious with the restrictions that were placed on Indian students a few years ago. Good luck doing a trade deal without that being eased.

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 Post Posted: Tue Oct 10, 2017 10:57 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
So again you avoid the question.


Very Knockeresque then.

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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 6:55 am 
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shropswolf wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
And I would completely close the door on all non EU immigrants apart from the Professionals required due to a national shortfall.


How is that going to play when you are needing to do a trade deal with them?

More freedom of movement for their citizens to enter the UK will be pushed for by every country the UK tries to negotiate with. India, for one, is furious with the restrictions that were placed on Indian students a few years ago. Good luck doing a trade deal without that being eased.


Who said developing new trade partners while reducing immigration was going to be easy.

With the public seemingly voting for lower immigration at the referendum as the first priority reason.

So something has to give and that surely has to be the economic stability of the nation.

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 Post Posted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:54 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
shropswolf wrote:
knocker knowles wrote:
And I would completely close the door on all non EU immigrants apart from the Professionals required due to a national shortfall.


How is that going to play when you are needing to do a trade deal with them?

More freedom of movement for their citizens to enter the UK will be pushed for by every country the UK tries to negotiate with. India, for one, is furious with the restrictions that were placed on Indian students a few years ago. Good luck doing a trade deal without that being eased.


Who said developing new trade partners while reducing immigration was going to be easy.

With the public seemingly voting for lower immigration at the referendum as the first priority reason.

So something has to give and that surely has to be the economic stability of the nation.


So the economic stability of the nation will indeed be sacrificed for lower immigration(?). No wonder they want to boot out Philip Hammond given he said that "people did not vote on June 23rd to become poorer, or less secure."

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 Post Posted: Thu Oct 26, 2017 8:32 am 
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Tories pilot scheme paying untrained members of public to host NHS patients in spare rooms.

These fuckers have cut bed numbers.

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 Post Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 8:13 am 
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The Tories have created what now is a CRITICAL CONDITION within the NHS.

UNDERFUNDED.

A one per cent increase each year is fuck all, it barely covers added costs.

At least FOUR PER CENT PER YEAR EXTRA IS REQUIRED.


Now this WINTER the number of DEATHS, added Deaths of the general public depends on one thing.

HOW HARSH IS THE WINTER.

And some of you vote for these fuckers, how fuckin dare you.

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 Post Posted: Thu Nov 09, 2017 9:33 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
The Tories have created what now is a CRITICAL CONDITION within the NHS.

UNDERFUNDED.

A one per cent increase each year is fuck all, it barely covers added costs.

At least FOUR PER CENT PER YEAR EXTRA IS REQUIRED.


Now this WINTER the number of DEATHS, added Deaths of the general public depends on one thing.

HOW HARSH IS THE WINTER.

And some of you vote for these fuckers, how fuckin dare you.


Calm, pastel shaded room and tablets required.

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 Post Posted: Fri Nov 10, 2017 12:37 am 
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knocker knowles wrote:
The Tories have created what now is a CRITICAL CONDITION within the NHS.

UNDERFUNDED.

A one per cent increase each year is fuck all, it barely covers added costs.

At least FOUR PER CENT PER YEAR EXTRA IS REQUIRED.


Now this WINTER the number of DEATHS, added Deaths of the general public depends on one thing.

HOW HARSH IS THE WINTER.

And some of you vote for these fuckers, how fuckin dare you.


How dare they ??- ffs get a grip- they voted for them because they did not want to vote for the alternative.

I'll let you into a little secret - you may like Jezza and his vision for the Labour party but there are plenty who do not.

There are plenty of old Labour voters who will never vote for him.

There are plenty of left of centre Tories who would rather stick pins in their eyes than see him and his ilk in power.

Many youngsters were lied to/allowed to mis interpret his 'loose representation' of what he would do with student debt.
I doubt all of them will be so easily misled next time.

The Labour party - or at least the left of it - laud him when in actual fact he did and will cost them many votes.

His leadership reminds me of Neil Kinnock's - much trumpeted but ultimately doomed to failure.

Many will never vote for Corbyn as they just don't trust him - or like him.

Maybe the best chance Labour have will be to change leadership -and direction- before the next election - I'm prrety sure the Tories will.


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 Post Posted: Mon Dec 11, 2017 10:06 am 
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NHS trust boss resigns in protest over underfunding of health services

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... SApp_Other


No hiding place for Tories who accept underfunded front line services.

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 Post Posted: Tue Dec 12, 2017 12:03 pm 
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knocker knowles wrote:
NHS trust boss resigns in protest over underfunding of health services

https://www.theguardian.com/society/201 ... SApp_Other


No hiding place for Tories who accept underfunded front line services.


Whilst I personally agree with the opinion that the NHS is badly underfunded I think we have to look at the wider picture before gloating over a comment by one individual. Mr Kerslake is not as independent as is made out because he is currently doing some work for the Labour Party on policy development. I understand that the Trust from which he resigned has been under investigation for poor financial management and it seems likely that he would have been removed from his post in the near future anyway. I have to admit that these comments are taken from everyone's favourite objective paper, the Daily Mail, but I just feel that it is important to look at things in context and take a balanced view.

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